The following interview with Michel Azcueta, mayor of
Villa El Salvador, by Jaime de Althaus,first appeared in the
Lima daily Expreso (May 19, 1989).*
Do you have problems with terrorism?
Yes, but I can count them on the fingers of my hand. There
was an attack on the police station, another at the local offices
of the APRA party, and a third against a justice of the peace,
between 1984 and 1985. The most recent one was an attempt
to attack a local market last year which the people blocked.
The terrorists started to agitate and told the people to ransack
the market. The people didn’t follow them, and the terrorists
were arrested.
Neither Sendero Luminoso nor the Movimiento Revolucion-
ario Tupac Amaru (MRTA) have a presence in the neighbor-
hood organizations?
Not in any. Not in the popular organizations, nor in the
feminist organizations. Not among the youth groups, nor in
the teachers’ organization. When people have clear objec-
tives and a development plan, the alternative of Sendero,
which is the alternative of desperation, does not take hold.
You also have a system of urban defense groups called
rondas. How do these function?
The rondas are organized by block. Villa El Salvador is
organized by blocks of 24 families, and groups of 16 blocks.
The rondas keep watch over the blocks at night. It is a public
system. In the courses where the ronderos are trained, we
invite the mayor’s office and the Civil Guard [police] to give
talks. There is mutual respect.
“* From Latinamerica Press (Lima) June 1, 1989.
Do all the blocks have rondas?
Not all groups do-it is voluntary. But they have been
growing, and a large number of blocks do have them. There
are also popular inspectors in charge of the internal security
for a group, which is made up of 384 families. They have the
power to authorize public festivals, maintain internal order,
and to control the prices, quality, measures and weights in
grocery stores, corner stores and markets.
Is a popular inspector paid?
For two and a half years they worked for free. But in the
last six months they’ve received 20% of the fines that they
collect for infractions in the markets. That’s a help for them.
They aren’t city employees. They are elected in the group
assembly and if they do not work out the community can
remove them from office and name another. The job is only
for one year but they can be re-elected. They are recognized
by the mayor’s office and the Civil Guard.
What do the rondas do with criminals they capture?
They notify the Civil Guard immediately. There is only
one police station in Villa El Salvador. They guard the
criminals, call the police station and then turn them over.
Then the system of urban rondas does not have anything to do
with terrorism, only with common crime?
They deal with internal security in general. But the
atmosphere of security and development that we have achieved
is effective against terrorism….The key is to foster grass-
roots democracy, to encourage the democratization of popu-
lar organizations, in order to plan development at the local
level. The state, the central government and public busi-
nesses need to respect and support this grass-roots democ-
racy. I believe that this way at least some of the problems that
the communities bring to our attention can be resolved.
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